Hi James,
How are you? I read almost all content of your website. But my confusion is that Vedanta said Consciousness is “changeless”. Then why does Consciousness manifest himself as “name” & ” form”?
As I talk this question with my master and he said that when Consciousness needs to know other than itself(world), it takes name and form. But this answer of master does not satisfy.
Please help me to understand this point.
Thank you,
Sundari: I am replying on behalf of James. Your ‘master’ is wrong. Consciousness has no needs because it is whole and complete. It is Self-knowing because there is only itself to know. If that were not the case, reality would not be non-dual and there would be no escape from duality. But we know that reality is not a duality but a nonduality. Maya, beginningless ignorance, the power to delude, is a power in Consciousness which makes the changeless appear to be changing. It is the power for Consciousness to apparently limit itself, with the emphasis on apparently. Consciousness can never limit itself because there is only itself.
However, because Consciousness is limitless, it must contain all powers, including the power to apparently limit itself or it could not be called limitless. Maya is not always manifest in Consciousness, but when it does, the dream reality we know as the world of form, the experiencing entity/person or jiva, appears. Then there is apparently something for Conscious to know, but as it sees only itself, there is no actual world for Consciousness. All forms dissolve in the Self. Duality is only a superimposition onto nonduality, just like a movie on a screen.
The world of form is a dream world because it is not real. Real is defined as that which is always present and unchanging, which only applies to the non-experiencing entity, the limitless Self. Consciousness has no form, though it seemingly gives rise to all forms. It is the causeless cause. Much needs to be taught about this, but I need to know a little about you first. You are obviously studying with someone else. If they are not a qualified teacher of Vedanta, it is very possible you will receive ignorance mixed with knowledge, or worse, ignorance presented as knowledge. A true Vedanta teacher would never present themselves as a ‘master’, which is a totally dualistic concept. It puts the teacher above you, and how can that be, if there is only one Self? As Vedanta teachers, we teach you as the Self because that is how we see you.
Sumesh: I know consciousness is alone. It is modulated within itself to take a form of world.
Sundari: No, Consciousness does not modulate ‘within’ itself. Consciousness does not have a within or without because there is nowhere it is not. It does not and cannot modulate to anything because there is only itself. Consciousness has no form and never takes any form. The forms we see are not real. If Consciousness became matter or took form, it would have to cease being Consciousness to become something else. It would have become limited, bound by time and space. There would be no sentient objects and no movement possible in the creation. Isvara, which is Consciousness plus Maya, is the uncaused cause of creation; it is both the intelligence behind the substance and the substance itself. However, although the creation arises from Consciousness (because Isvara is Pure Consciousness associated with Maya), Isvara cannot become the creation. Therefore, the effects (matter/form) is just an apparent transformation of the cause, Consciousness. It is not an actual transformation because if it were, Consciousness would have lost its limitless nature when it transformed into matter.
There are two kinds of changes possible in mithya, the apparent reality:
1. Parinama, ‘permanent’ change. The best example of this is milk and cheese. If we make cheese out of milk, the milk has to stop being milk to become cheese. This process cannot be reversed; we can never get the milk back. Another one is the clay and the pot, or the gold and ring. The clay and the gold have to stop being clay and gold to become a pot or a ring
2. Vivarta parinama: Apparent change: Although the milk seems to have become cheese, the essence of cheese remains milk, without which there would be no cheese. The same applies to the pot and the ring; their essence remains clay and gold. Although it seems as if Consciousness has ‘become the world’ and taken form, it has not. Owing to the agency of Maya, Consciousness (seems to) appear as the world. But, as stated, the world is only apparently real. It is like a movie on a screen, a superimposition. Which is which is why we can negate it.
Sumesh: My questions, how it happened? How can Consciousness apparently limit himself? All teachers always said that world is an appearance. But how?
Sundari: I answered this above. The ‘how’ is clear if you understand what Consciousness is, who and what Isvara is, how Maya works, and what the jiva is. They all have the same identity as Consciousness, but exist in two different orders of reality, nonduality (satya) and duality (mithya). If you are able to discriminate satya (Consciousness/nonduality) from mithya (duality/the effects of Maya) you would not need to ask the how or the why. That is where all the teaching takes place in Vedanta. I am happy to teach you, but as I said previously, I need some background from you first.
It is clear from what you write that your understanding is lacking. Most probably you have not been systematic in your Vedanta study, and/or have been incorrectly taught by whoever your ‘master’ is. There is nothing wrong with having a devotion to other teachings and teachers, but if you are interested in freedom from the limited and suffering experiencing entity, it requires a commitment to self-inquiry and to being properly taught. You say you read all of James’ materials, which is good. But do you have a proper sadhana, are you following our instructions for following the methodology of the teachings as presented on our website and in James’ book, The Essence of Enlightenment? It helps me to help you if you give me more information about where you are at.
Om, Sundari
